....are not receiving the emails I send them. Has any otherrat had this
problem? I use Pipex, but a friend who uses a completely different isp is
having the same problem. It can take anything from 4 hours to 3 days before
the failure message bounces back, which is really annoying, as you don't
know at once that your message hasn't got through. We're beginning to think
the problem is at the btinternet end, rather than ours. Any tecchierats out
there who've heard of something going on deep in the bowels of
btintenet/Yahoo! Towers?

ally

a l l y wrote:
> ...are not receiving the emails I send them. Has any otherrat had this
> problem? I use Pipex, but a friend who uses a completely different isp is
> having the same problem. It can take anything from 4 hours to 3 days before
> the failure message bounces back, which is really annoying, as you don't
> know at once that your message hasn't got through. We're beginning to think
> the problem is at the btinternet end, rather than ours.

I recently (within the last 5 days) sent an email to a btinternet
address with no problems. I don't know its delivery time but I did get a
reply from the other party within the day. My mail goes out via gmail's
smtp server.

Colin

a l l y wrote:
> ....are not receiving the emails I send them. Has any otherrat had this
> problem? I use Pipex, but a friend who uses a completely different isp is
> having the same problem. It can take anything from 4 hours to 3 days before
> the failure message bounces back, which is really annoying, as you don't
> know at once that your message hasn't got through. We're beginning to think
> the problem is at the btinternet end, rather than ours. Any tecchierats out
> there who've heard of something going on deep in the bowels of
> btintenet/Yahoo! Towers?

This is a year old, but it looks rather like the same problem you are
having:
http://www.chromosphere.co.uk/2008/0...oo-slow-email/

Which doesn't give us any answer on how to fix your problem if you're
not running your own mail servers, other than to move to another ISP.
If this is, indeed, the problem.

the Omrud wrote:
> a l l y wrote:
>
> This is a year old, but it looks rather like the same problem you are
> having:
> [..]
>
> Which doesn't give us any answer on how to fix your problem if you're
> not running your own mail servers, other than to move to another ISP. If
> this is, indeed, the problem.

And here:
http://www.ahfx.net/weblog.php?article=107

Looks like they're still doing it.

"the Omrud" <usenet.omrud> wrote in message
news:2790
> the Omrud wrote:
>
> And here:
> [..]
>
> Looks like they're still doing it.
>
<sigh> I can't tell all my btinternet friends - let alone customers! - to
move to another isp! This is ridiculous. Have I been "greylisted" for some
reason? It means it's back to using the phone to contact a few of my
friends, or alternatively, I can email another friend, as a go-between -
someone whose messages seem to be accepted by btinternet/yahoo - and get
them to forward the message to my btinternet friends. But if a customer with
btinternet emails me, presumably I won't be able to reply now. Why do big
companies have to mess around with things that worked perfectly well until
they got their hands on them?

ally

a l l y wrote:
> "the Omrud" <usenet.omrud> wrote in message
> news:2790
> <sigh> I can't tell all my btinternet friends - let alone customers! - to
> move to another isp! This is ridiculous. Have I been "greylisted" for some
> reason? It means it's back to using the phone to contact a few of my
> friends, or alternatively, I can email another friend, as a go-between -
> someone whose messages seem to be accepted by btinternet/yahoo - and get
> them to forward the message to my btinternet friends. But if a customer with
> btinternet emails me, presumably I won't be able to reply now. Why do big
> companies have to mess around with things that worked perfectly well until
> they got their hands on them?

You could try sending via another smtp (gmail works for me.) gmail will
happily write the headers so that my mail comes from my standard address
rather than my gmail address.

Colin

Colin Blackburn wrote:
> a l l y wrote:

If this is indeed what is happening, it's not aimed at your mail
address, but is applied to your whole ISP or email domain for some
reason. And from what I read they are not amenable to reason.

The mail is not actually being blocked, but is being initially rejected
to try to avoid spam which doesn't bother to retry; however, this seems
to be badly implemented in such a way that the retry never actually
happens and the message eventually times out.

> You could try sending via another smtp (gmail works for me.) gmail will
> happily write the headers so that my mail comes from my standard address
> rather than my gmail address.

But thereby hangs an even more contentious problem - Google put in an
extra header which is translated by Outlook (and some other mail
clients) so that the user sees:

From fred On Behalf Of joe

which defeats the point of sending via gmail - the recipient sees the
underlying gmail account address as well as the intended address.

a l l y wrote:
> ...are not receiving the emails I send them. Has any otherrat had this
> problem?

Aha! Yes, the person who isn't getting mails everyone else is getting
(see previous post, was it in this thread? not sure) is btinternet.
Last time we spoke on the phone she said she had the impression she
wasn't getting as many emails as she used to.


I use Pipex, but a friend who uses a completely different isp is
> having the same problem. It can take anything from 4 hours to 3 days before
> the failure message bounces back, which is really annoying, as you don't
> know at once that your message hasn't got through. We're beginning to think
> the problem is at the btinternet end, rather than ours. Any tecchierats out
> there who've heard of something going on deep in the bowels of
> btintenet/Yahoo! Towers?

Will be interested to see of any solutions.

the Omrud wrote:
> Colin Blackburn wrote:

>> You could try sending via another smtp (gmail works for me.) gmail
>> will happily write the headers so that my mail comes from my standard
>> address rather than my gmail address.
>
> But thereby hangs an even more contentious problem - Google put in an
> extra header which is translated by Outlook (and some other mail
> clients) so that the user sees:
>
> From fred On Behalf Of joe
>
> which defeats the point of sending via gmail - the recipient sees the
> underlying gmail account address as well as the intended address.

I have no experience of Outlook. The header added by gmail is
Return-Path: None of the mail clients I use do anything other than
display it as a header if asked. Hitting reply would send the mail to
joe as required.

Colin

Colin Blackburn wrote:
> the Omrud wrote:
>> I have no experience of Outlook. The header added by gmail is
> Return-Path: None of the mail clients I use do anything other than
> display it as a header if asked. Hitting reply would send the mail to
> joe as required.

Indeed, a Reply will go to the correct address.

I believe it's the Sender header field which is filled with your actual
Gmail account address, which is displayed by some mail clients as "on
behalf of". This has been causing considerable annoyance for more than
a year, as can be seen in this Google Group:

http://groups.google.com/group/Gmail...7f0e9baa0c0ffc
http://groups.google.com/group/Gmail...7f0e9baa0c0ffc

And many other places ...

the Omrud wrote:
> Colin Blackburn wrote:

>> I have no experience of Outlook. The header added by gmail is
>> Return-Path: None of the mail clients I use do anything other than
>> display it as a header if asked. Hitting reply would send the mail to
>> joe as required.
>
> Indeed, a Reply will go to the correct address.
>
> I believe it's the Sender header field which is filled with your actual
> Gmail account address, which is displayed by some mail clients as "on
> behalf of".

Sorry, but isn't this about the email coming from a different server
rather than what the end recipient sees in the headers? I.e it's how the
Yahoo/btinternet servers interpret the email rather than how Outlook
displays it when it finally gets there?

Colin

Colin Blackburn wrote:
> the Omrud wrote:
>> Sorry, but isn't this about the email coming from a different server
> rather than what the end recipient sees in the headers? I.e it's how the
> Yahoo/btinternet servers interpret the email rather than how Outlook
> displays it when it finally gets there?

Ah, my apologies, I had swerved and was (in this case) talking about the
issues with using Gmail as an SMTP service for "other" email addresses,
in general.

Ally's original problem with BT/Yahoo might be avoided by using Gmail to
send the mail through, but I thought it worth mentioning that here is a
side effect which may not be acceptable.

"the Omrud" <usenet.omrud> wrote in message
news:7250
>
> Ah, my apologies, I had swerved and was (in this case) talking about the
> issues with using Gmail as an SMTP service for "other" email addresses, in
> general.
>
I did warn my friend, when I suggested mining the knowledge base that is
umra, that the thread might wander off in uncontrollable directions. Seems I
was right!


> Ally's original problem with BT/Yahoo might be avoided by using Gmail to
> send the mail through, but I thought it worth mentioning that here is a
> side effect which may not be acceptable.
>
It's a bit of a pain having to use gmail for just a few emails though. I
only use it at the moment when people are sending me big files, as there's a
lot of storage space there, and I always ask them to send another email to
my normal address to let me know they've done it, otherwise I wouldn't know
it was there as I don't check very often.

However, I do have several email addresses at home, so to speak, so I tried
this afternoon emailing a friend with a btinternet address using one of the
others. It got through. Might just be a one-off, but perhaps I just need to
use a different address.

We shall see.

ally

"Jane Vernon" <spam> wrote in message
news:3eu1
>a l l y wrote:
>> ...are not receiving the emails I send them. Has any otherrat had this
>> problem?
>
> Aha! Yes, the person who isn't getting mails everyone else is getting
> (see previous post, was it in this thread? not sure) is btinternet. Last
> time we spoke on the phone she said she had the impression she wasn't
> getting as many emails as she used to.
>
I had a feeling something similar had been mentioned, but couldn't find it.
I suspect anyone with a btinternet address is likely to be receiving fewer
emails these days.

I'll keep you posted on any solutions that appear.

ally

a l l y wrote:
> "the Omrud" <usenet.omrud> wrote in message
> news:7250
> I did warn my friend, when I suggested mining the knowledge base that is
> umra, that the thread might wander off in uncontrollable directions. Seems I
> was right!
>> It's a bit of a pain having to use gmail for just a few emails though. I
> only use it at the moment when people are sending me big files, as there's a
> lot of storage space there, and I always ask them to send another email to
> my normal address to let me know they've done it, otherwise I wouldn't know
> it was there as I don't check very often.
>
You can set up gmail to notify you of mails at your usual address, if
you want. I think, I can't remember how but I'm fairly sure the option's
there.
> However, I do have several email addresses at home, so to speak, so I tried
> this afternoon emailing a friend with a btinternet address using one of the
> others. It got through. Might just be a one-off, but perhaps I just need to
> use a different address.
>
Otherwise, you can set up gmail in your ordinary email message thingy
(I've compeletely umbrella'd what Thunderbird, for example, is, exactly)
rather than having to remember to go via the net to check for incoming mail.

> We shall see.

Good luck :-)