"John B" <spam> wrote in message
news:4da65c6f-c051-4363-92cd-e91e98662974
> On Jun 25, 1:26 pm, rosenst...@cix.compulink.co.uk wrote:
>
> There's a lift from the Piccadilly platforms direct to the District
> platforms. Not quite same-platform (although as mentioned upthread if
> you really need same-platform there's always the option of an
> Upminster train and a change to a Circle in the City), but not too
> heinous either.

Where is it? I use that interchange (escalator+stairs) from time to
time, and have never noticed a lift option.

On Jun 25, 3:57 pm, "Recliner" <recliner2-n> wrote:
> "John B" <s> wrote in message
>
> news:4da65c6f-c051-4363-92cd-e91e98662974
>>
>>
>>
>
> Where is it?  I use that interchange (escalator+stairs) from time to
> time, and have never noticed a lift option.

It's possible that my brain was entirely frazzled by jetlag, but I'm
*sure* I was pleasantly surprised to find a direct lift from the Picc
platforms to the District platforms when changing at EC on a return
trip from Heathrow last year. If I'm wrong then Colin's closer to
right than I thought.

In article
<dd63850f-f690-49ef-89d3-dfdf0dbc04d7>,
mizter.t (Mizter T) wrote:

[..]
> staircase to clear - and I asked the member of staff at the base of
> the stairs whether it's always as busy, to which they responded very
> much in the affirmative.
>
> I don't quite understand how FGW giving up a platform would help
> matters... unless they were to surrender platform 14 to LU, which
> could then become the eastbound Circle/Teacup platform. That would of
> course involve some fairly significant works to realign the LU running
> lines, and I'm pretty sure FGW could afford to give up a platform at
> Paddington anyway could they?

I read the request as for platform space rather than an actual platform. I
guess they need room for another staircase and maybe for widening the LU
island.

> Once Crossrail comes, then there will be more room for manoeuvre at
> Paddington as many of the suburban services will transfer to Crossrail
> and hence won't need high-level platforms. Plus Crossrail would of
> course take some of the pressure off LU at Paddington anyway, as pax
> stayed on their Crossrail train to reach further into central London
> or across into the City and beyond. So maybe the Teacup line plan is
> rather before its time, and would be better suited to a post-Crossrail
> London?

With the growth expected by then, will Crossrail do more than cope with
that growth?

Well, well, well, it's a bit late in the day to realise all this, isn't it?

However, I thought the teacup doubled the H&C frequency between Edgware
Road and Hammersmith or have I missed some thing? How much will that help
with the platform capacity issue?

In article <NflJS3HK93QKFAzp>, roland (Roland
Perry) wrote:

> In message
> <25cd10d6-dab6-41a5-9a16-45dc482966f6>,
> at 05:00:54 on Thu, 25 Jun 2009, John B <spam> remarked:
>
> Is that lift available from the District platforms. I seem to
> recall it going from the upper (Eastern) concourse.

The District platforms now have lifts to a footbridge across to the
walkway along the North Western wall of the trainshed. That gives you a
level but far from short link to the ticket office level which is the top
landing of the Piccadilly lifts.

> >Kings Cross -> [lift from next year
>
> It's two lifts - one up to the barrier level, then the current lift
> to the surface (outdoors, far from the station). Or they are also
> putting in a "three lifts" solution - an extra one between the
> barrier level and concourse, then a choice of lifts to various
> points at ground level.

Won't there be a route with lifts to the new Northern ticket hall?

In article <lemdnTYXstxbGt7XnZ2dnUVZ8jWdnZ2d>,
recliner2-news (Recliner) wrote:

> <rosenstiel> wrote in message
> news:vLydneaVrZGX8N7XnZ2dnUVZ8rydnZ2d
> <25cd10d6-dab6-41a5-9a16-45dc482966f6>,
>
> Presumably Picc platform level>lift>concourse>lift>District
> platform level

Indeed. Quite a hike! And up one level more than needed and down one again.

In article
<5a493896-1a32-458e-9817-fe08c31217db>,
spam (John B) wrote:

> It's possible that my brain was entirely frazzled by jetlag, but I'm
> *sure* I was pleasantly surprised to find a direct lift from the Picc
> platforms to the District platforms when changing at EC on a return
> trip from Heathrow last year. If I'm wrong then Colin's closer to
> right than I thought.

I can't think where that lift is then. I thought the lifts on the District
platforms only went up to the footbridge and the lift from the Piccadilly
was the modern version of the originals whose upper landing is at ticket
hall level. Unless the lifts on the District platforms also go down to the
Piccadilly?

On Jun 25, 4:16 pm, rosenst...@cix.compulink.co.uk wrote:

> In article
> <dd63850f-f690-49ef-89d3-dfdf0dbc0>,
> mizte...@gmail.com (Mizter T) wrote:
>> [snip]
>>
>>
> I read the request as for platform space rather than an actual platform. I
> guess they need room for another staircase and maybe for widening the LU
> island.

OK. Not quite sure how it'd work.

>
> > Once Crossrail comes, then there will be more room for manoeuvre at
> > Paddington as many of the suburban services will transfer to Crossrail
> > and hence won't need high-level platforms. Plus Crossrail would of
> > course take some of the pressure off LU at Paddington anyway, as pax
> > stayed on their Crossrail train to reach further into central London
> > or across into the City and beyond. So maybe the Teacup line plan is
> > rather before its time, and would be better suited to a post-Crossrail
> > London?
>
> With the growth expected by then, will Crossrail do more than cope with
> that growth?

Erm, I think it's a bit more complicated than just looking at it like
that. Travel patterns will change with Crossrail, placing less of a
demand on Paddington as an interchange location.

>
> Well, well, well, it's a bit late in the day to realise all this, isn't it?

Er, its not like LU have just realised this. We've discussed this
issue several times beforehand on utl. The LU planners will of course
be aware of the knock-on effects of the Teacup line plan, including
the effects on Paddington - I assume they don't think it's a show-
stopper. I'd (obviously) be interested to hear of the inside track on
this.

>
> However, I thought the teacup doubled the H&C frequency between Edgware
> Road and Hammersmith or have I missed some thing? How much will that help
> with the platform capacity issue?

Yes, frequency would be doubled, which would presumably help matters.

In article
<5faba746-ba86-475b-8f8f-3bf268c7aa15>,
mizter.t (Mizter T) wrote:

> > Well, well, well, it's a bit late in the day to realise all this,
> > isn't it?
>
> Er, its not like LU have just realised this. We've discussed this
> issue several times beforehand on utl. The LU planners will of course
> be aware of the knock-on effects of the Teacup line plan, including
> the effects on Paddington - I assume they don't think it's a show-
> stopper. I'd (obviously) be interested to hear of the inside track on
> this.

I have to say, as a utl regular, this was seriously news to me and I'm one
of (I suspect) a small minority here who might be directly affected. I'd
have thought I'd have noticed any such threads.

Recliner wrote:

> I assume the other option to 'break the Circle' would be to make use of
> the vacated FCC tracks at Barbican to provide a (turnback) siding or
> additional platform for Circle line trains. This might, for example, be
> used to hold a spare train to be deployed if the there's a big gap in
> Circle services, with one of the bunched trains then replacing it there.

Baker Street to Moorgate is one of the most congested sections of track and
may not be able to take the extra trains involved. Also reversing at
Moorgate involves crossing the tracks from the other direction and opens up
all manner of delay risks.

"Tim Roll-Pickering" <T.C.Roll-Pickering> wrote in message
news:7ahkveF1uprp3U1
> Recliner wrote:
>
>> I assume the other option to 'break the Circle' would be to make use
>> of the vacated FCC tracks at Barbican to provide a (turnback) siding
>> or additional platform for Circle line trains. This might, for
>> example, be used to hold a spare train to be deployed if the there's
>> a big gap in Circle services, with one of the bunched trains then
>> replacing it there.
>
> Baker Street to Moorgate is one of the most congested sections of
> track and may not be able to take the extra trains involved. Also
> reversing at Moorgate involves crossing the tracks from the other
> direction and opens up all manner of delay risks.

I was thinking of moving the inner Circle roue to the former widened
lines tracks, with the current inner Circle becoming the siding/extra
track.

In message <WuydnfgvXckkCd7XnZ2dnUVZ8ladnZ2d>, at 10:16:09
on Thu, 25 Jun 2009, rosenstiel remarked:
>> >Kings Cross -> [lift from next year
>>
>> It's two lifts - one up to the barrier level, then the current lift
>> to the surface (outdoors, far from the station). Or they are also
>> putting in a "three lifts" solution - an extra one between the
>> barrier level and concourse, then a choice of lifts to various
>> points at ground level.
>
>Won't there be a route with lifts to the new Northern ticket hall?

Urgh. I was getting Northern and Piccadilly lines confused.

The lift from the Piccadilly (and also the Victoria) will emerge into
the passage between the Northern Ticket Hall and the old Thameslink
Station. (I discovered last week that the exit there has limited opening
hours).

In each case the lift will be quite short, bypassing a small flight of
stairs.

If you follow the passage north-west, it will eventually meet the
*bottom* of the main escalators down from the Northern ticket hall.

A long lift will by-pass those escalators, but only up as far as the
northern ticket barrier/concourse level. You'll need a third short lift
to get to ground level.

http://www.perry.co.uk/images/kx-com...with-lifts.jpg

In article <lUnzw7fCW6QKFAGH>, roland (Roland
Perry) wrote:

[..]
> of stairs.
>
> If you follow the passage north-west, it will eventually meet the
> *bottom* of the main escalators down from the Northern ticket hall.
>
> A long lift will by-pass those escalators, but only up as far as
> the northern ticket barrier/concourse level. You'll need a third
> short lift to get to ground level.
>
> [..]

Thanks.

rosenstiel wrote on 25 June 2009 16:34:33 ...
> In article
> <5a493896-1a32-458e-9817-fe08c31217db>,
> spam (John B) wrote:
>
>> It's possible that my brain was entirely frazzled by jetlag, but I'm
>> *sure* I was pleasantly surprised to find a direct lift from the Picc
>> platforms to the District platforms when changing at EC on a return
>> trip from Heathrow last year. If I'm wrong then Colin's closer to
>> right than I thought.
>
> I can't think where that lift is then. I thought the lifts on the District
> platforms only went up to the footbridge and the lift from the Piccadilly
> was the modern version of the originals whose upper landing is at ticket
> hall level.

That's correct. And just to clarify, the footbridge over the District
platforms is at ticket hall lavel.

MIG <googlespam> wrote in news:15d5c237-2cb0-4318-b6af-
107fff154e4e:

> On 25 June, 10:43, wensleyd...@pacersplace.org.uk (Neil Williams)
> wrote:
>> On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 10:22:12 +0100, Scott
>>
>> <spicedporkand> wrote:
>> >Thanks.  I take it Boris will organise a competition to choose a new
>> >name then.
>>
>> AIUI it will still be called the Circle Line.
>
> I suggest Circle becomes Teacup, District becomes Saucer, Bakerloo
> becomes Spoon ...

Making the entire Bakerloo line in Spoon will make the game interesting.

On 26 Jun 2009 06:32:50 GMT, James Farrar <james.s.farrar>
wrote:

>Making the entire Bakerloo line in Spoon will make the game interesting.

Wouldn't that make Rushton's Gambit illegal?

Guy