On Jul 19, 11:55 pm, Bruce <docnews2> wrote:
> I'm visiting Scotland in a couple of weeks, travelling to Glasgow
> Airport then onwards from Glasgow Central station.  
>
> What is the best (fsv: "best") way to get from Glasgow Airport to
> Glasgow Central station?  I don't have any time to waste (hence flying
> to Glasgow rather than using the train) but I don't want to spend a
> lot of money either.

Partly depends on where you're going next. If it's the WHL, then a cab
to Dalmuir might be worth considering.

(this is what I /would have done/ last time I needed to get from
Glasgow Airport to Fort William, were KLM not a hopelessly inept
airline. Instead, they paid GBP200 for a cab all the way...)

On Mon, 20 Jul 2009 06:41:04 +0100, "Mark B!" <nospam>
wrote:

>Charles Ellson wrote:>>
>> "Glasgow Airport" or "Glasgow Prestwick Airport"?

>If he's flying Easyjet then it will be to Glasgow Airport. Ryanair on
>the other hand...

Glasgow Edinburgh if the winter timetable has started.

On Mon, 20 Jul 2009 02:46:48 -0700 (PDT), EE507 <ee507>
wrote:
>On Jul 20, 12:36 am, Bruce <docnews2> wrote:
>
>So booked well in advance then. What about parking, luggage fees and
>coming back?


No parking costs, as my neighbour works at Luton Airport and is giving
me a lift. I have one carry-on item of luggage. I'm collecting a car
which has been under restoration for a couple of years and driving it
back, so my trip by public transport is one way only.


>> That doesn't pay more than a
>> small proportion of the overall train fare including sleeper berth,
>> the cheapest available for that night being £117.40 plus £49 for the
>> sleeper - and that's having to share a sleeper compartment.  :-(
>
>That part I can believe - such is the under- and over-pricing of
>aviation and rail respectively.


Yet you think people who commute by rail should pay much higher fares?

You're quite a mass of contradictions, EE507! ;-)


>> On the basis of time, rail doesn't work for me.   I absolutely have to
>> be at home the night before my flight.
>
>But presumably you'll be out the door no later than 05:00 to make your
>06:30 check in.


My neighbour leaves home at 05:30. He gets to work at Luton Airport
at 06:20 for an 06:30 start.


>> The earliest practicable train
>> in the morning (dep AYS 05:35) would get me in to Glasgow Central at
>> 12:01, which is a couple of hours too late as I have a long onward
>> journey.  My flight from Luton arrives at Glasgow Airport at 08:20,
>> which is absolutely perfect.
>
>Presumably arriving at Glasgow bus station around 09:15.
>
>Did you consider the 06:22 Milton Keynes to Glasgow (10:36)? A
>pendolino yes, but with WiFi to make your journey time-effective.


I'm not taking my computer - this trip is not for work. The Pendolino
from MK might have been OK, and it would have saved the cost of the
sleeper berth, but faced with the choice of four and a quarter hours
on the train or 50 minutes in the air, I prefer to fly. I used to
commute weekly to Scotland when I worked in Paisley, and it became
second nature. Minimising the time spent shoehorned in with other
people is the key and, for me, the plane and train are about equally
(un)comfortable.


>> On the basis of comfort, rail doesn't work for me.  I cannot get a
>> good night's rest in a Mk 3 sleeper - I have used them quite a few
>> times, and always arrived tired and even more grumpy than usual.
>
>Getting up at 04:00 and airport security have that effect on me.


I'll get up at 04:45, have a quick shower, dress and have a bowl of
cereal and a cup of coffee by 05:30. Five hours later I expect to be
driving south in my newly restored vehicle, and that's the part of the
trip that I am *really* looking forward to. Everything else is just a
chore, hence my wish to minimise the time and money spent. ;-)

On Mon, 20 Jul 2009 23:58:39 +0100, mcp wrote:

>On Mon, 20 Jul 2009 06:41:04 +0100, "Mark B!" <nospam>
>wrote:
>
>>Charles Ellson wrote:>>
>>> "Glasgow Airport" or "Glasgow Prestwick Airport"?
>
>>If he's flying Easyjet then it will be to Glasgow Airport. Ryanair on
>>the other hand...
>
>Glasgow Edinburgh if the winter timetable has started.
>
That will be Glasgow Edinburgh (Oslo) ?

On Jul 21, 12:24 am, Bruce <docnews2> wrote:
[..]
> No parking costs, as my neighbour works at Luton Airport and is giving
> me a lift.  I have one carry-on item of luggage.  I'm collecting a car
> which has been under restoration for a couple of years and driving it
> back, so my trip by public transport is one way only.  
>>
> Yet you think people who commute by rail should pay much higher fares?
>
> You're quite a mass of contradictions, EE507!  ;-)

Nice try. You know perfectly well it's the magnitude of the discount
offered to long-distance commuters that I object to. Your figure of
£166.40 - if correct - for a single to Glasgow is expensive.

> >> On the basis of time, rail doesn't work for me.   I absolutely have to
> >> be at home the night before my flight.
>
> >But presumably you'll be out the door no later than 05:00 to make your
> >06:30 check in.
>
> My neighbour leaves home at 05:30.  He gets to work at Luton Airport
> at 06:20 for an 06:30 start.

That's tight as someone else has pointed out, but it's your call.

On Mon, 20 Jul 2009 16:49:05 -0700 (PDT), EE507 <ee507>
wrote:

>On Jul 21, 12:24 am, Bruce <docnews2> wrote:
>> On Mon, 20 Jul 2009 02:46:48 -0700 (PDT), EE507 <ee>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >That part I can believe - such is the under- and over-pricing of
>> >aviation and rail respectively.
>>
>> Yet you think people who commute by rail should pay much higher fares?
>>
>> You're quite a mass of contradictions, EE507!  ;-)
>
>Nice try. You know perfectly well it's the magnitude of the discount
>offered to long-distance commuters that I object to.


Change your mindset. In areas where commuting is the norm, such as
most of the former Network SouthEast, look at season ticket prices as
"the normal fare". Then the occasional traveller using peak hour
trains is asked to pay a premium over "the normal fare".

Hey presto! No need to get upset any more!


>Your figure of
>£166.40 - if correct - for a single to Glasgow is expensive.


But that includes a £49 sleeper berth. I never quoted £166.40, what I
said was £117.40 plus £49 sleeper berth.


>> My neighbour leaves home at 05:30.  He gets to work at Luton Airport
>> at 06:20 for an 06:30 start.
>
>That's tight as someone else has pointed out, but it's your call.


Tight? This is travelling with someone who does the same journey
every working day of the year. He hasn't been late for work in the 12
years he has worked at the airport. It's an easy journey at that time
of the morning, but I admit that it can take much longer at other
times of the day.

In message <c2pa6597qnbft24q4okqcrgsqntpf4gdpk>, at 08:40:29 on
Tue, 21 Jul 2009, Bruce <docnews2011> remarked:
>>> My neighbour leaves home at 05:30.  He gets to work at Luton Airport
>>> at 06:20 for an 06:30 start.
>>
>>That's tight as someone else has pointed out, but it's your call.
>
>Tight? This is travelling with someone who does the same journey
>every working day of the year. He hasn't been late for work in the 12
>years he has worked at the airport.

The potential tightness is getting through security and to the gate for
06.45 (25 mins before departure). It's likely to be a busy time of day
[there are 10 flights scheduled to depart between 6.55 and 7.20]

Today, for whatever reason, all of them left 10 minutes late.

Obviously you'll have to check in online because airport check-in
closes at 6.30 .

On Jul 21, 12:24 am, Bruce <docnews2> wrote:
> I'm not taking my computer - this trip is not for work.  The Pendolino
> from MK might have been OK, and it would have saved the cost of the
> sleeper berth, but faced with the choice of four and a quarter hours
> on the train or 50 minutes in the air, I prefer to fly.  I used to
> commute weekly to Scotland when I worked in Paisley, and it became
> second nature.   Minimising the time spent shoehorned in with other
> people is the key and, for me, the plane and train are about equally
> (un)comfortable.

This is the complete opposite of my attitude: given a choice of

a) 2 hours jumping through assorted hoops, queueing, being stressed,
being x-rayed and prodded, and generally not getting to sit down and
get on with anything, plus 1 hour in a seat (most of which time you're
banned from moving, using a computer, listening to music, etc).

b) 4 hours in a seat with freedom of movement and use of tools and
gadgets, able to get on with working/reading/window-gazing without
having to worry about anything

....I'd go for the latter, in the absence of a crazy price advantage to
air.

It'd be interesting to survey The People and find out how prevalent
the two viewpoints are - particularly when the train journey is 3
hours and so there's no actual time gain from the plane.

On Jul 21, 11:29 am, John B <s> wrote:
[..]
> b) 4 hours in a seat with freedom of movement and use of tools and
> gadgets, able to get on with working/reading/window-gazing without
> having to worry about anything
>
> ...I'd go for the latter, in the absence of a crazy price advantage to
> air.
>
> It'd be interesting to survey The People and find out how prevalent
> the two viewpoints are - particularly when the train journey is 3
> hours and so there's no actual time gain from the plane.

People never compare like with like: it's always 1p on Ryanair vs ££££
£ for an Anytime (or Off-peak on the ECML) fare. In the minds of many
people a short-haul fare of £20 is the norm (booked yonks in advance
of course), yet we know the story would be very different if aviation
were taxed and the polluter pays principle adopted.

Of course it doesn't help that certain TOCs have drastically reduced
cheap(ish) ticket quotas in order to protect revenues. I suspect there
were bargain berths on the Glasgow sleeper for Polson's travel date
(if not a Friday night obviously), but if there weren't there
certainly should have been until recently. In this specific case, VT
now wants about £80 for an Advance fare from Milton Keynes, because
this is classed as a peak period despite the tidal flow clearly being
into London. It would be interesting to know what the fare was at the
time the flight ticket was purchased. I have to admit I wouldn't be
keen to fork out £80 for 4 hours on a Pendolino, whereas for travel on
a quality train such as an ICE this seems much better value for money.

Joe Public always seems to forget about airport access time, the
various security hassles, punctuality, baggage collection and egress
time to the ultimate destination. For some reason many are still in
awe of air travel and forgive its many failings. In this case the
easyJet website is clear that check-in closes 40 minutes before take-
off, yet the passenger-to-be seems totally unconcerned...

In message
<0fb0b9b9-ed1b-42eb-b98b-c0e491f61be8>, at
03:29:59 on Tue, 21 Jul 2009, John B <spam> remarked:
>On Jul 21, 12:24 am, Bruce <docnews2> wrote:
>
>This is the complete opposite of my attitude: given a choice of
>
>a) 2 hours jumping through assorted hoops, queueing, being stressed,
>being x-rayed and prodded, and generally not getting to sit down and
>get on with anything,

In Tony's case (ignoring the car ride) he's only allowing about 30
minutes for that stage - including the walking to the plane from the
gate.

>plus 1 hour in a seat (most of which time you're
>banned from moving, using a computer, listening to music, etc).

Yes, on a 1hr flight (including taxiing times etc) there is not much
time with electronic gadgets.

>b) 4 hours

It's five and a quarter from MK early in the morning [including changes
at Manchester and Preston], and even then it gets to Glasgow too late
for Tony's onward trip.

>in a seat with freedom of movement and use of tools and
>gadgets, able to get on with working/reading/window-gazing without
>having to worry about anything

There's still the possibility of noisy neighbours, people encroaching on
your personal space etc. Depending on the route it may or may not be
possible to leave a seat and come back to find it (a) still empty and
(b) your possessions intact. Neither of these is as much bother on a
plane, although there are isolated reports of people having passports
stolen (or maybe they just misplaced them).

And I've only once had a plane where the "window" seat was next to a
blank wall (rear-most row on an Easyjet A319 I think, the same plane as
Tony's using), but trains have these more often.

In message
<ed21d79f-eb55-4b65-aafe-ae731f108f6e>, at
03:53:07 on Tue, 21 Jul 2009, EE507 <ee507> remarked:
>People never compare like with like: it's always 1p on Ryanair vs ££££
>£ for an Anytime (or Off-peak on the ECML) fare. In the minds of many
>people a short-haul fare of £20 is the norm (booked yonks in advance
>of course),

To be fair, the recession seems to have meant that far more "cheap"
airline tickets are available close to departure time. Not universally,
but a definite trend. For example it's £71 Luton to Glasgow for travel
later *today*. A week in advance and it's £40.

On the other hand, "cheap" rail tickets are becoming harder to find.
Witness the time it took me to book my "Round Britain trip" for this
August a whole month in advance. Only by hours of work and some
suggestions from others did I get anything remotely like a "bargain".

>yet we know the story would be very different if aviation
>were taxed and the polluter pays principle adopted.

In what sense are railways taxed and airlines not? Is there a "passenger
duty" for Eurostar?

>Of course it doesn't help that certain TOCs have drastically reduced
>cheap(ish) ticket quotas in order to protect revenues.

It wouldn't, would it ?

>VT now wants about £80 for an Advance fare from Milton Keynes, because
>this is classed as a peak period despite the tidal flow clearly being
>into London. It would be interesting to know what the fare was at the
>time the flight ticket was purchased.

The cheapest fare for the first train of the day is currently walk-up
£115 every Tuesday for a month, and the same for every Tuesday I checked
until October.

>In this case the easyJet website is clear that check-in closes 40
>minutes before take- off, yet the passenger-to-be seems totally
>unconcerned...

He can check in online, in which case all of the 40 minutes in the
airport can be used for security and getting to the gate, where he has
to be 25 minutes early (but I look upon that as the "getting on the
plane and sitting down" time, which just part of the trip).

On Jul 21, 12:16 pm, Roland Perry <rol> wrote:
> >VT now wants about £80 for an Advance fare from Milton Keynes, because
> >this is classed as a peak period despite the tidal flow clearly being
> >into London. It would be interesting to know what the fare was at the
> >time the flight ticket was purchased.
>
> The cheapest fare for the first train of the day is currently walk-up
> £115 every Tuesday for a month, and the same for every Tuesday I checked
> until October.

The Virgin and NXEC booking sites are both giving me gbp38.50 for the
0622 direct train from Milton Keynes to Glasgow Central next Tuesday
28 July. This takes 4h14m.

On Jul 21, 12:00 pm, Roland Perry <rol> wrote:
> >b) 4 hours
>
> It's five and a quarter from MK early in the morning [including changes
> at Manchester and Preston], and even then it gets to Glasgow too late
> for Tony's onward trip.

No, its 4h14 minutes direct (0622 arr 1036). Since Tony hasn't
actually posted details of his onward trip, I'm not sure how you've
worked that out.

On Jul 21, 1:15 pm, John B <s> wrote:
> On Jul 21, 12:16 pm, Roland Perry <rol> wrote:
>
> > >VT now wants about £80 for an Advance fare from Milton Keynes, because
> > >this is classed as a peak period despite the tidal flow clearly being
> > >into London. It would be interesting to know what the fare was at the
> > >time the flight ticket was purchased.
>
> > The cheapest fare for the first train of the day is currently walk-up
> > £115 every Tuesday for a month, and the same for every Tuesday I checked
> > until October.
>
> The Virgin and NXEC booking sites are both giving me gbp38.50 for the
> 0622 direct train from Milton Keynes to Glasgow Central next Tuesday
> 28 July. This takes 4h14m.

Well for that date it's a no-brainer. Unfortunately we don't have more
details of the OP's date of travel and time of booking.

In message
<7dfc0aaa-df4f-4553-b001-6dc8491d137f>, at
05:15:59 on Tue, 21 Jul 2009, John B <spam> remarked:
>> >VT now wants about £80 for an Advance fare from Milton Keynes, because
>> >this is classed as a peak period despite the tidal flow clearly being
>> >into London. It would be interesting to know what the fare was at the
>> >time the flight ticket was purchased.
>>
>> The cheapest fare for the first train of the day is currently walk-up
>> £115 every Tuesday for a month, and the same for every Tuesday I checked
>> until October.
>
>The Virgin and NXEC booking sites are both giving me gbp38.50 for the
>0622 direct train from Milton Keynes to Glasgow Central next Tuesday
>28 July. This takes 4h14m.

Hmm, something very funny going on. When I looked earlier I was sure the
first train was the 06.47 . Sorry for the red herring.